We're down to the last couple of weeks of the qualifying season, and Pavlina and John are still atop the standings, but the fat lady hasn't sung yet -- there are still some high-point sprints to come, plus the 50-pointer at the Canadian Champs last weekend where it took several days of high-powered math (Boris, of course, could have done it in a few minutes...) to come up with a reasonably credible set of results, which will be reflected in our next update.
Meanwhile, everything is rounding into shape for the Sprint Finals at Hickory Run SP in northeast Pennsylvania on the weekend of September 16-17.
Resgistration deadline -- sign up online -- is Sunday night, September 10.
As with last year, if you want to request a wild card in a heat higher than you would otherwise qualify for, send me an e-mail (pg@crocker.com)saying why.
Sprint finals info and registration.
Sprint standings.
Schedule of remaining events
Peter
pg@crocker.com
http://www.coc2006.ca/results/COCSprintRC.html
here are the results from COC sprint ( course 2 women, course 3 men ).. then wait few minutes and see what Boris did.
thanks Boris for all your work on the sprint series.
Are we sure these are correct for all courses?
At any rate, I think I'll wait till tomorrow to do the next standings update, after the Alberta Sprint Champs.
These results are still incorrect for 67% of my family. Zach's time on course 1 does not have his start time subtracted out (17 minutes), and I don't show up in last place on course 3.
You probably better check Glen Tryson's time, 747.46. M45s might be slow, but 12 hours 27 minutes and 45 seconds seem beyond belief for a sprint.
For the record, my watch showed about 27:30, so the twelve hours is a bonus. Maybe I 'll use the "official" time in my log to gain a psychological advantage for the Sprint Finals by making it look like I've really upped my training. :-)
Hei Glen , apparently U did not download after the event ( ooops ), we can retrieve from a back up but contact the COC administrator
bishop 22 , contact also the administrator
Actually, I downloaded twice. I was an early finisher and the first to point out to the results crew that there were some problems when I saw my splits. They kept the first printout of my splits, but I have the printout from the second download. In the results as posted, my time is off by 12 hours, so it looks like a 12hr versus 24hr clock issue (subtracting 720 minutes from the posted time is within 4 seconds of the time on my watch). Nick - Could you please post the contact for the COC administrator. Thanks.
admin@coc2006.ca
this is the one..
Ok, i'm going to update the Sprint Series standings this afternoon and include the COC sprint. Glen and bishop22, if you tell me the exact times (and course #) i should use for you and your families, i will use them. Otherwise i'll go with whatever is on the website right now.
Just curious... have the officials decided to ignore the fact that the earlier-starting men had to punch their maps as many as 6 times, while later starters had functional SI at all their controls?
if I am not wrong, only 2 elite men were in that category. Hans was trying to get an earlier start, honestly i do not know if he did got it on not after 2 attempts. same with Chris P.
everyone else in that category had the same conditions.
too bad that the morning went the way it went, however we should never allow time changes. I'm not sure but I don't think at a national champs ( maybe not even in US ) people can ask for special start time and get it. late or early. I do agree 100 % at all A meets it is OK, but at the trials or nationals should not be happening. I just imagine how it would be myself asking for a late start on the classic ( for whatever reason), received , run and as we know the grass was a huge factor for speed, end up in a different position.
and overall I believed it is ignored.. if controls dissapear half way thru the race, what should be the outcome...??
In the US, most registrars honor start time requests, regardless of whether or not it is a championship race. The exceptions are the team trials and interscholastics, which have specific rules.
If fairness is an issue (and I'm not questioning that one way or the other), it makes no sense that the rules be different at championships. Why should championships be "more fair" than other A meets, especially when the results of all A meets contribute to ranking, which in turn contributes to team selection (and even if they didn't the question still stands).
As for some runners losing time due to malfunctioning SI units, that may fall into the category of "bad luck" (e.g., the weather changed during the race), although if a fair and unambiguous remedy could be determined, I personally would not be against it.
There is a precedent for this, at least in my case. The first runner in a race often has to turn on the units, and this incurs a delay of about 1-2 seconds. The SI operator adjusted my time by 1-2 seconds for each unit after I downloaded :-)
Conditions change throughout races, but not usually because the organizers change them, which is why this situation seems different. I don't know why the SI turned on partway through the race for some controls, but it must have involved some actions taken by the organizers at some point, so I don't view it the same way as the formation of an elephant path through deep grass. I guess the answer is that if nobody protested within 30 minutes of the results being posted, the results stand as they are.
By the way, AP discussions tend to focus on elites, but the vast majority of participants at this or any orienteering event are not elites (including many people in the 20-34 age group), hence I would also be concerned about how this may have affected the results for others beyond the top ten.
In the US, most registrars honor start time requests, regardless of whether or not it is a championship race. The exceptions are the team trials and interscholastics, which have specific rules
No start time changes for WRE, and a random draw. Preferably done by Evalin pulling pieces of paper from a hat.
Lest it appear that some COC sprint competitors were frivolous in asking for new start times, be aware that everyone's actual start time was a good 90 minutes later than expected due to the late start of the middle distance event earlier in the day. The first start took place around 5:30 p.m. on a relatively cool Saturday evening, and some competitors had families with small children waiting around in the park for quite awhile - even longer than expected from the 90-minute delay, because of the subsequent download problems. Other out-of-towners had made dinner arrangements with family and friends that they don't see often, based on the very reasonable expectation that they would get away in time. So since this wasn't a WRE, I wouldn't be too hard on anyone who asked for a change.
I wasn't .. somehow within the same age category , runners had almost the same conditions.
Once again , i'm not trying to find excuses for an event that did not went good in some aspects .
But maybe a motion should go to COF for fainess purposes , that at COC, trials and NAOC start times to be random and not by request. I often ask for special start times when I go to US, but different story at a major national champs.
Added the results of the Canadian Champs and the Alberta Champs, and while some Canadians have moved up in the standings, with less than a week to go, and only a week and a half to the Sprint Finals, it looks like John and Pavlina will be getting their names on the big checks. The only question is -- what will the currency be? Yen would give us a pretty big number again, but how about Belarus rubles (2142 to a dollar) or Venezuela bolivars (2145 to a dollar)?
Resgistration deadline for the Finals -- sign up online -- is Sunday night, September 10. As with last year, if you want to request a wild card in a heat higher than you would otherwise qualify for, send me an e-mail saying why.
Sprint finals info and registration.
Sprint standings.
Schedule of remaining events
Peter
pg@crocker.com
I recommend the
Hungarian pengo, mid 1946 version.
according to the last check on the sprint standings , I don't think John F, Mike S, Hans (and others ) points from COC where taken in consideration . it was a 50 pointer, and" for sure" some canadians will go even higher on the list.
am I wrong ?
Actually, all the points are added correctly, but for some reason, the actual score from the Canadians didn't show up. We'll fix that and re-post the scores, but the standings aren't going to change. (For example, if you look at the eight scores listed for Hans, 46+40+39+37+34+30+30+30=286, while he is listed as having a total of 302 points. This means that his 46 from the COC's was counted, but for some reason failed to show up. Make sense?)
Looks like Jon Torrance is going to be the lone Canadian star in attendance... only 4 days left to sign up?!?? come on, guys! it'd be a shame if the attendance was such that yours truly were to survive the first round.
Book your tickets to the final, Vlad, because the rest of the Canadians must be too scared to get in your way...
...if I am not wrong, only 2 elite men were in that category. Hans was trying to get an earlier start, honestly i do not know if he did got it on not after 2 attempts. same with Chris P.
I've been away canoeing in Killarney since the COCs (so much AP to catchup on) and I am pretty certain there's something wrong with my sprint results; Yes, I took an early start as I did not have one prior to the race and was forced into a spare slot at 33min (...thus had six non-functining SI units). However, I also started behind Eugene and caught him up (he too had six non-functioning SI units), but according to the results he finished in front of me. Given this and my feeling of a near clean run something seems outta wack. ...so, where do I pick up my gold medal? ;)
Well, not scared but there's an anesthesia conference that I can't work around so that's my excuse. And I imagine the GHO guys are working pretty steadily to ensure the NAOCs are a super success (and I am completely certain that they will be).
Also, with only 6 sprints I think I have a paltry 244 points - I wouldn't be in the top 12 anyway.
But Jon should give y'all a good run for your money just the same.
We'll settle the real sprint winner at the NAOC's! ;-)
A chance for 35 points on your last pre-finals day:
http://www.wyattriley.com/Training/TeamEvent200609...
If Sam drives down, and wins, she's still a point behind Pav. But if Hill drives down and wins, she passes Sam... :)
Boris perhaps this is unfair to ask you to do additional work, given the excellent job you have done on the sprint rankings. But I'm curious as to what the Sprint standings would look like if only the best 6 races counted?
My guess is that it wouldn't make much difference to the top 3, but would perhaps better reflect the top sprinters down to 16 who qualify for the A final. Wilsmith provides a good example.
I've nothing personal invested in this, as I think a more competitive sprint ranking would clearly lower my ranking on average in any given year, and in any case I've only run 3 sprint races myself this year.
Has there been prior discussion on AP of why 8 races is the magic number? I realize is encourages race attendence, but perhaps this incremental attendence only applies to a small minority of runners, and its benefits are outweighed by an attendance based rather than ability based ranking outcome.
I don't propose a change to this year's ranking so close to the end, but it seems like now is the time to consider the scoring criteria for next year.
given the results at the world stage of runners from NA, I believe is fine the 8 number.
also it's true that in Canada and someother places in US is hard to get 10-12 races ( and count only your best 8 ). but if the number is lower , that will go to reverse,we'll get better /accurate standings for runners, but will need less competitions to attend, therefore less training att high level.. how this will impact the oversee results ?.
next year I hope that we'll have more events, rather then less being counted
also maybe after this year sprint series , the 2007 series should take in account sprint starting october 1, 2006 ( yeap including NAOC),till sept 1 2007 and not wait till jan 1. there might be more events this year where people can score for next year.
btw I have only 6 sprint races this year, but I rather blame me for not attending more ( or having not too many opportunities in Ontario) instead of taking less then 8 in consideration.
As of now Wilsmith would be 8th among those registered, so he would be in the A final, if he weren't one of those scared Canadians. Also, only 12 spots are guaranteed to qualifiers based on score; there are 4 wild card spots available, and I'm guessing the commissioner has not been flooded with requests for those spots yet.
Has there been prior discussion on AP of why 8 races is the magic number?
I can't answer that specific question, but when the series was conceived, the goal was to provide motivation for people to conduct and attend sprint races. It was thought that 8 is more likely to accomplish that goal than a lower number.
The main objective behind the founding of the Sprint Series was to get NA clubs to set more sprint courses and to get our athletes running more sprints. That is why the total number of races counted is on the high side.
However, the addition of 4 wildcards allows the commissioner the power to ensure that all of the best Orienteers can make it into the Finals even if they aren't able to get to enough races. Wil Smith will most certainly get a spot in the Finals even if he isn't in the top 12.
Hmmm, just who is this mythical
Wil Smith of which you speak, if that is his REAL name. I see no such name on the
Sprint Series Finals entered runners list
He is on the Anesthesia Conference entered doctors list.
> or the scared list of canucks.
Wil ! give them an anesthesic and let's go K some B
Okay, I'm not really scared, I lied. But anyone's got a private jet to fly me to the event? J-man, your famous international business man maybe? I promess not to sing or laugh at your o-suit if you get me a flight.
Let's ask him. Greg, will you come to the rescue of a damsel in distress?
This discussion thread is closed.