Discussion: Night O backup lights

I would like to hear backup light strategy suggestions for regular night O? Tiny light that burns forever just to get out of the forest? Or better one to continue race? Size, weight, brands&models, best battery types, how to carry etc? This may have be discussed before, but with today's light technology things may have changed lately.

For under $6 US, Walgreens (a US drugstore chain, of all places!) sells a 12 LED headlamp.

That's so cheap that you could give it away to a team mate without worrying about getting it back. You unscrew the plastic knob on the left side to access the batteries; I believe it operates on 3 AAA cells. I would guess that you could continue to navigate effectively with such a backup, and have no need to drop out.

Ay Up lights keep burning with the intensity of a halogen for 8 hours or so once the battery has gone "dead"... check them out, they were originally mtb lights but work awesome for orienteering/running/adventure racing...

If you want to keep navigating, get a new generation 50 lumen Princeton Tec Eos or Eos II with the Rebel emitter. It throws a decent beam, and it's probably the most light for the least weight you'll find anywhere commercially. Also 3AAAs.

It'll set you back $40 or more, but be sure it's not the older 25 lumen Eos. Both throw a way better beam than the many-little-led variety.

Ayups would be a bit pricey for a back up, but the light is great and they're basically indestructable, so you wouldn't need a back-up :) I took mine (meaning the ones I borrowed)for an ocean swim (unintended) en route to DNFing my last AR and they're stil all good.

I always carry a Petzl Tikka with me any time there's even remote chance of getting caught in the woods after dark. Quite sufficient to get out of the woods and could be used to finish the race in a pinch. Very small, very light, very tough, runs for a long time on even on high, and can be had for under $30.

At first I thought getting something small and lightweight that gives lots of light for just some minutes and mybe just some dim light after than. I'd continue race only if the main light fails ear the end. I already ordered a small 1 x AAA flashlight that should use the battery fast and die soon, but I began to doubt is it wise choice at all. Maybe back up light should burn a bit longer than something like couple of minutes. But I don't see much point using a light that burns for days either.

Weight with AAA nimh battery is 38g. CREE XR-E Q5. It gives decent light for 45 min. 100 lumens they claim, but difficult to say. Maybe for first minutes. Looks like 5-6W halogen to me. It burns over 1 hour but after 45 min it's not bright enough for running.

What brand and model is that light?

This Chinese no name light. No idea how unreliable it is. It has boost driver, 3xAAA direct drive/resistor one would have been far more reliable. I think it wouldhave been better to have a more simple light as backup light. But let's see, I use it for commute biking to find out will does it work or not, it's easy to but on an handle bar with the same rubber string.

thats what i meant fletch... ayups are their own backup.

thats a beautiful light you got there jagge ;)

You wouldn't need back up is you have doubled lightning system. Like two dual ay-ups with two wires and two batteries. But you'll easily end up having some extra weight.

haha, true, my diy lamp a real beauty, isn't it. But don't let the ugly retro look mislead you, the filling is the very latest led tech. You need three or four dual ay-ups to get the same amount of light. Beam pattern isn't so bad either.


Off topic as usual.

Doesn't that kind of defeat the purpose of night orienteering??

Well, if the purpose of night orienteering is having so little light you can't see your footing, increase injury risk and make it miserable having to carry heavy battery packs, then yes. But if it's about being able to navigate with limited visibility, running as fast as you fittnes lets you with a light weight gear, knowing how to use a bright headlamp, routechoices, taking green more seriously than daytime etc. then not.

Note, in green (or just in average Finnish white mapped forest) you'll see with the biggest moster lamp about the same as with a tiny light: then next branch one meter away. There is just blackness behind it because branch is so much brighter than background. Branch is just a lot brighter with a monster lamp. Open areas hasn't been much of a problem with olds style lights, so no much difference there. With more light and less weight you can run faster. And speed usually makes O just more challenging as we all know.

Or at least this is how I see it after using all too much time and money for playing with these toys.

Jagge, post your other "lower power" 350 lumen version here too. To me it's also a thing of beauty

I'm looking at using one R2 with a narrower beam in my monster light to add some distance throw, keeping the other 2 P4s for flood).

I carry a backup pack of 4 lithium AAs which can power the big kahuna for a long time on low power. I can't see the light itself failing, but sometimes have the EOS in my pack as backup.

What is the output of your light Jagge? And what does it weigh?

The beam shot looks impressive, but I have seen weak lights look better than awesome ones in such shots depending on the exposure time

Ay-Up use 2x CREE XRE-Q5 LEDs and put out 320 lumens for 3 hours, then last a number of hours after that with usable intensity. The complete light with elastic head strap weighs 170g.

Jagge - I'm actually really impressed with the light. I also hate both heavy battery packs and not being able to see where I'm going, but that photo pretty much looks like you've turned night into day. You could have a fair bit less light and not be at risk of injury...

but obviously there's never going to be a limit on light output for night-O, so go for your life. I'm too lazy to build my own. I'll stick with the AYUPs.

MTBfred - you can also easily stick a 6hr battery pack on the back of the headband (not that much heavier)

Right, photos are all about how they are taken. The one posted here is not taken by me (I am not the guy in the photo).

Ay-up set wet elastic head band, 320 lumens and <200g is excellent light and about best you can buy. I have never seen it but I am sure, no need to build of buy better one if one feels like 320 lumens is enough light. And if not, it's not bad idea to use two fo those with longer wires to belt battery pack. Seriously. 640 lumens, weight of head part might get even lighter and total weight would be something like 450g (2 x 190g + longer wires - one elastic head band + maybe some kind of belt, if not carren in back zip pocket). Petzl ultra belt weights 490g and Lupines wilma 475g and Tesla ~440g. Au-up users are ot the first ones who should consider building lamps or changing brand!

My lamp weights at the moment 210g + 37g wire to battery back (all the way to O pants back pocket) + battery pack. I have several battery alternatives: 125g 5Ah li-ion, NIMHs 135g 2.7Ah, 245g 4Ah, 5,4Ah. All aimed for 50min - 2h runs, I can get more runtime by using lower mode or connecting NIMH packs parallel. Specs say output is 800-900 lumen at 2.8A. I use normally 2.8 but I have also "turbo" mode 3.8A, it should give 1000+ lumens. Turbo is useless, diference is so small.

The other home brew lamp, "low power one" 'Bent is referring to weights 120-200g depending on battery pack, outputs 320-350 lumen. I don't think it's as good as Ay-up. Can't be because it was so easy to make :) and cheap. I'll start soon new thread on AP about home brew lamps if you like to hear more.

Note, lot's of guys here have been using Lupines, 830 lumen (I have one of those too) of 1400 lumen , or 1000+ lumen HIDs. I am just expormenting how easy it is to cut costs by doing it by myself. I am not the monster lamp guy here, I am to one who has funny looking retro gear.


From left: Lupine wilma (830 lumen), DIY light and 20W Ohalogen with fresh battery straight from the charger.