Discussion: Orienteering Today

So I got issue 2 yesterday (hooray) but never got issue 1. Anyone experience this in NA?

Yes, and I sent an e-mail to them yesterday explaining the situation. I'm waiting to hear back from them. I guess they just forgot to do the mass mailing to North America on the first issue, or at least I'm hoping that's what the problem is/was.

Me too. There was some post on another thread that they tried to mail 2006/1 from Poland and got screwed up; they've reverted to Czech mail for 2006/2 onwards. 2006/1 was supposed to have arrived a week or so ago at last advice.

The discussion a couple of weeks ago.

I haven't seen either issue yet.

Me too, didn't get either of them.

I'm finding this thread both encouraging and discouraging! My husband and I are trying to form an orienteering club in our area. We have lots of Adv. Rac. friends here, so I've been recruiting for the USOF by passing out apps. When they ask me what they will get, I generally respond "Oh, I don't know, I think some funky little magazine" It looks like from reading this thread the mag is actually going to be pretty good! Too bad they probably won't get it! :-)

Orienteering North America is the magazine that they would get for joining USOF. Its delivery schedule is very reliable. Orienteering Today is a really nice magazine from Europe, but as you can see there are problems.

Jan is away on a training camp (and a pre-WOC fact finding I guess) in Denmark with a couple of the Czech team. He should be back home in Czech very soon and I imagine he will be able to reply to this thread himself. In the meantime this is what I know.

According to Jan, when he took 2/2006 to the Polish post (to send to European subscribers only) and complained about 1/2006 not making it to non- European subscribers they agreed to re-send 1/2006 at no extra cost. It seems there are still problems.

Meanwhile, as mentioned in a post above, a decision has been made to use Czech post for non-European subscribers from 2/2006. My issue 2 arrived a couple of days ago (I am in Japan), thanks to Czech post. But I am also yet to see issue 1.

I know Jan is very disappointed about letting down his subscribers and is trying to fix the problem. The decison to use Polish post was an economic one. This year Czech post drastically increased its rates with no notice, so Jan looked into other options in an attempt to keep costs down and ensure the magazine remains viable.

Rob Plowright (contributor and proof reader for Orienteering Today)

THank you Rob for such a great explanation... I was going to inform the readers about it but you saved me from writing a long explanation!
Having said that, my Issue number 1 came in 2 days ago, so it shouldn't take long before all of yours do come in. There is obviously a clear advantage to living in the mountains ;-)
Cheers all!

I guess it must be solved now/soon. I got issue 1 yesterday (even in the remote Ontario north...). Still no issue 2 but I guess it'll be here any time, especially if they used Czech post for it.

I love getting the magazine, and if I have to pay even a bit more for reliable delivery through Czech post, then so be it. It provides truly invaluable connections and inspiration in every issue.

I got my issue 2 yesterday night and hope issue 1 is on it way ...

Likewise.

Mike's copies still have not arrived. He looked so forlorn as he checked the mailbox one last time before he got on the plane to Sweden.

Is anyone else still waiting for any issue to arrive?

Yes, I'm still waiting for both. I guess it takes a little longer to get them west of the Mississippi.

I've got my copies and will take mine back to Sweden on Weds. for Mike to read. ;-)

I've got issue 2 but not 1.

we received two of the first issue, hope that the second issue arrives!

Still missing Number 1.

We got our #2 today in NB

Hello Everybody. Back from Denmark now, I've just read this thread and again it made me upset. Meanwhile I hope more of you got the missing copies of 01 and also 02 has arrived.

As for the explanation, I can only tell you that Rob gave you all the details correctly. These really were the reasons why we had to send out the issue 01 with the Polish post.

Meanwhile, we have been working on Issue 03/2006, which will be dominated by two big reports - EOC in Estonia, and a really hot one - Jukola in Finland where I'm travelling with Lucie to prepare for you 18 - 20 pages of the best action photos, maps, stories and interviews from this event. Issue 03 you'll get by the in your mailboxes beginning of July and it will be sent again with the Czech post, same as all the remaining issues of 2006.

Also, starting with 2007, Orienteering Today should become a year round magazine, so you will be getting it all year long, from January to December. Not just from April to December as has been the practice so far. This will mean much more regular reading for you all.

Again sorry for all the troubles.

Jan

How do I sign up for this magazine?

Year round? Awesome! Oooh!

Jan, you won't lose many subscribers, if any, if you put up the price for mailings outside Europe to cover the difference in price for using Czech mail rather than Polish. And issue 2 was just as good as ever! I apologize for my slightly snide comment in the other thread. Keep up the good work!

Any chance you could arrrange to print and mail copies destined for US/Canadian addresses in NA and avoid the Polish/Czech post for overseas mailings alltogether? Seems to me that the content could be shared via the web/email (depending on the size of the files etc.) with a distributer (read: another orienteer who you know and love and is willing to do this for you) who could print and mail locally.

Just an idea I had with my limited knowledge of the details of the situation.

While I am addicted to O Today and am thus pretty price inelastic, I do appreciate the efforts to keep the price down. I do know several O enthusiasts who don't subscribe, because at what is effectively $10 an issue, they are priced out of the market.

Can you save 25c/day (25c * 365d = $91.25) ?! Then you can afford yearly subscription too.

Sure I'll be glad to see lower prices too, but quality of the magazine is outstanding and it doesn't have all these annoying ads ...

It's all about framing, discounting, and mental accounting.

Is it possible to view your subscription status, i.e. when you need to resubscribe? Will we receive any kind of warning when our subscription is running out?

pdf or e-book format could be solution, at least eliminates delivery problems. Or online access to content.

it sure would bring the costs down (after an initial investment, anyway.)

That's true, but call me old-fashioned, but I realy like getting that glossy magazine in the mail. I would be willing to pay a lot less for online-only content.

Nothing beats cracking open a new O Today and flipping through it.

same here, but some folks prefer e format. what could be better than openning smelling fresh paint new magazine...

I'm also for an e-format just because of the snail mail expenses.

Oh, please cast my vote for the print version - there's more than enough stuff on the internet these days, and to me, nothing beats that wonderful, portable, easy-to-read glossy that comes in the mail.

My issue #2 came today, by the way, in a nice and neatly _hand-addressed_ envelope with a return address from Jan himself - I am truly impressed with the service they provide, and will basically pay whatever it takes to keep the printed magazines coming. Compared to what it costs for me to get anywhere near an orienteering map (the closest maps are 400-600km away...), the price of O Today is a bargain!

In Pennsylvania, I got 02 a little over a week ago - like j-man. But I still don't have 01 and I think he doesn't have it either.

Thanks Jan for sending 02 via Czech post.

As for the price, I'm a subscriber, so I don't mind the current level. Although it was hard to sign up in the first place - it's per-issue price is probably at least 3x the level of any other magazine that most people subscribe to. Now that I get it, I'll keep doing it, but the hurdle wasn't easy to cross.
(Although if I get enough motivation from one of these articles to go to one of these cool international events again, that'll cost more than I've ever paid for the magazine...)

As for paper or e-, I am definitely with Wil & j-man - I wouldn't want to do O-Sport online. I spend way to much time sitting at a computer already (e.g. now :), and it's nice to get good maps, routes & stories that I can read anywhere - I've even taken it on training runs...

Definitely stick to the hard-copy format.

I'm still without 01 or 02! Grrr...

Hard-copy/print/paper/magazine for me too.

Obviously, this calls for the invention of a magazine hyper-transport tube between major isolated orienteering locations, like San Antonio and Dallas, or Philadelphia and wherever it is in Canadia that they got issue 1... Tom, I'd beam #2 up to Dallas if I knew it would survive the trip.

You could all solve the problem by moving to Europe :)

True, but then there is a change (very remote) that we wouldn't be as starved for the high quality content in the magazine as much and would not suffer the wrenching withdrawal symptoms when deprived of the fix for a while.

Content could be sent to NA using the web and printed and distributed here. People would still get their paper which I prefer as well - ever try to take a computer to the um.... office? - and the mailing would be less expensive and perhaps more reliable. The only point that would remain to be worked out is who would receive, print and deliver the magazine. The potential cost savings might be a good way to increase subscriptions. If it were my magazine I'd look into it.

That is a nice suggestion. I have to imagine, even if you did it on a contract basis, that it could generate some savings. Bu. printing is expensive, and they haven't cut any corners with it. I wonder how Czech printing costs would compare to those in NA?

>>hillanddalle: You could all solve the problem by moving to Europe :)

Still haven't gotten my second issue here in Uppsala...

Other than the extra work of having to lay things out for the web or some other e-format, I don't see why there couldn't be both electronic and glossy hardcopy. I suspect that Jan could at least double his non-European subscriptions and even get higher margins to boot.

I really like the idea of finding someone in North America who could take charge of printing and distributing the magazine here in NA. I wonder how much work it would require...

Unless quantity is big enough its a monkey business. These are numbers for 52 pages magazine with glossy finish (and some impovements and something I dont know what plus 1000 magazines will be shipped after priniting by print shop)

1000 $5371.47
2500 $6899.22
5000 $8210.16
10000 $11244.51

And to add to the cost, their layouts are designed for a slightly different size of paper (European standard), which would definitely be a pain and very $$$

Boris, you have seen issue number 2 in Cambridge (MA), though. That's the reverse of the originally proposed solution...

I did a bit of research and found one nice little price estimator at PrintPelican.com: http://www.printpelican.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=m...

It seems that they will be able to print a 52-page magazine at 8.5x11 in. at the following prices (including shipping):

25 - $895.40 ($35.82 per mag)
100 - $1205.41 ($12.05 per mag)
500 - $4198.20 ($8.40 per mag)
1000 - $5384.94 ($5.38 per mag)

Of course OT is printed larger than 8.5x11, but the price increase isn't that dramatic for larger sizes. I am not sure what the exact size is, but I tried a theoretical size of 10x12 in. and this is how the prices came out:

25 - $1000.30 ($40.12 per mag)
100 - $1349.58 ($13.50 per mag)
500 - $4752.72 ($9.51 per mag)

What are we currently paying for shipping?

Less than that, or Jan would be making a loss on every issue sold outside Europe assuming the $10 per issue figure quoted above is roughly right... ;)

I just checked out OT's website and the shipping charges for overseas are 23 Euros(~$29.46) for 7 issues. That comes out to about $4.21 per magazine. Now depending on how much they are currently paying for printing, this might actually help lower the price.

I wrote to Jan to see if he would even consider printing OT locally in NA for NA subscribers, and I sent him a link to that price estimator, so we will see what he says.

There may be even cheaper options, but this seems to be at least a good starting point. If Jan likes the idea than we can all pitch in to try and find the best option.

mine numbers were from the same PrintPelican.com

We received issue #2 today.

I paid $73.85 for my subscription. I wonder if others paid less? I didn't do any funky currency stuff.

Funky currency stuff, as in paying with counterfeit Estonian kroons (currency symbol EEK, of course)?

imagine, what cool staff could be having Orenteering NA as a part of Orenteering Today and printed at OT quality. ONA quantity automatically moves project into acceptable zone.

The reason ONA is not printed at the high quality of OT is purely cost. I would need many more advertisers to add more color and use a better paper. USOF pays only a portion of what it costs to print and mail the magazine. There is no reason OT could not be printed in USA and mailed by the printer. That's what I do. The contact info for my printer is Caren Maynard (carenm@cummingsprinting.com). Webpage is www.cummingsprinting.com

Received OT #2 today in the UK.

At some point in the last week OT issue #1 arrived. :-)

I got mine, too, and it is excellent.

Me too, week or so ago.

Same here, on Mon or Tue. Is it safe to assume all the N.A. subscribers have theirs? yay!