I am wondering if anyone has had any success putting in some real solid speed for endurance running such as a 50 mile race. I am doing a 50 mile race in December and have currently been mixing in some fartlek stuff and some hard hill runs. The race is very hilly so my thought is to have one day working on speed/strength with short 2-3 minute hard hill repeats at close to max effort over the time and then one day working at around 1 hour w/effort level hovering in the 80-85% range. Kind of like the typical lydiard tempo run. Then I would do a long run on really hard hilly terrain and try to just keep pace up on the run. The other days would mainly be mileage/recovery days with not much focus.
Does anyone have any thoughts. Is that type of speed training going to limit my gains I could have from just putting in longer runs
I haven't found that I and L (Daniels' letters) training are at odds with each other. In fact, Daniels even recommends doing your long run the day after I or T workouts (and that's typically what I do). This is possible because the I/T stuff works primarily your cardio system, leaving the skelatal muscles in decent shape for a long effort the next day. Now, if you're talking hill sprints, that's another matter as that can leave your legs flat for several days. I don't think you'd want to be taking big chunks out of your training for a 50 with that sort of thing.
I should add the disclaimer that none of the ultra's I've done have been particularly hilly. I do, however, think my relative success in them has a lot to do with the fact that I do a lot more I/T work than most ultra runners.
Run long, run often.
Check PG's log for a story of his first ultra 50.
The speed work for me really helped me in the 50K- one day on the track doing repeats of at least 800 up to one mile. Other ultradistance races have not gone well for me most notably I have had really bad leg pain. Now that the biathlon is going so well I have not dabbled with it again hoping that aging might help along with the extensive weighlifting if I do try it again. Otherwise lots of mileage most important two long runs per week.
I have found that I recover relatively quickly from the hill stuff and actually all summer have been doing relatively consistent work of Threshold runs. Was thinking of starting to add in some leg speed stuff like 800s-miles at I pace along with the hills. Haven't worked too much on hills in the past and have ended up keeping a schedule of Tues-Tempo hills (like 3x10min uphill at 85%, Fri-6x2 minutes uphill at 90-95% or what would be considered I pace and then doing a long run on sunday. Leaving the rest of the week for relatively easy stuff, but still putting in the mileage. I am noticing that my calves are getting quite a bit of tightness since adding in this type of intensity. I am interested in the idea of throwing in some speed on saturdays if I only have one other quality day during the week and then running long on sunday. I think that would give me a good way to get in a quality flat long run on Thursday so that I have two long runs in. I have mostly just been doubling up on most days to get mileage up, but I am thinking that as I get closer to the race I should be having two long runs in each week
I'd be hesitant to do too many double days when training for an ultra. One run of two hours is a lot more valuable than two runs of an hour each. When I put in a second workout, it's usually on the bike so it doesn't interfere with my running recovery.
As for 2 long runs a week, my experience is that those are most effective if you do them back-to-back. Make the second day longer and flatter than the first.
While I don't think it's necessary to hammer too hard on the speed days, I do think that the addition/maintenance of some quality in training is valuable. The biggest thing that I've found is that if you continue doing some shorter repeats throughout your training, your running efficiency remains good. As soon as I drop any speedwork or even strides from my schedule, I become a plogger. I should also add that I believe a certain amount of barefoot/five fingers is helpful in this department too. Hilly (and flat) tempo runs, plus making sure the long runs are specific to the race type is great too.
As for mileage... everyone is different, but I'm a big believer in running as much mileage as your body can comfortably handle. I went much higher with mileage this year for a recent 100miler (ave. 15.5 hrs per week of running for 12 weeks with a high week of 24+ hrs) and finished much stronger.
Re: Back to backs...I didn't do many in this build up, but found that a midweek medium run combined with a weekend long run worked well for me. Mind you, once again I was averaging 2-3hrs per day running...while including some doubles (ie. am=2hrs, pm=30-60mins easy).
I was doing speed work 6-2 months prior to my 100 miler (once a week with a group). I backed off 2 months prior as the speed work along with all the mileage on my body was becoming too much, as the hill triaing and the time on my feet was becoming way more important. But I would do it all the same again, as I believe the structure a) helped me to stay motivated and not bored, b) I believe kept me an overall rounded athlete, instead of a one pace ultra runner.